Saturday, August 2, 2014
Israel vs. Palestine, Redux
by Tom Kando
Again and again. The Israeli-Palestinian conflict is forever. It has raged since before I was born, and it will not be solved by the time my grandchildren are gone. To paraphrase Dennis Quaid when he played the president of the United States in American Dreamz, the Israel-Palestine problem will NEVER be solved.
The latest war, which pits Israel against the Hamas wing of the Palestinians, was triggered by the murder of three Jewish kids, which led to the reprisal murder of a Palestinian kid, followed by a great increase in Hamas rockets raining down on Israel, and thereupon Israel’s bombing campaign and invasion of Gaza.
Here is a list of some of the issues about which people have been taking sides forever, ad nauseam. A similar article was written by Ali Rizvi on the Huffington Post recently, titled “7 Things to Consider Before Choosing Sides in the Middle East Conflict.”
The case against Israel:
1. The “asymmetrical” number of deaths: Over 1300 Palestinians so far, of whom 75% are women, children and other innocent civilians. About 60 Israelis, of whom 2 or 3 are civilians.
2. Israel practices Apartheid. Palestinians within Israel are second-class citizens, and many of those outside its borders have been living in subhuman conditions for over 60 years.
3. Theocracy is bad. When people’s rights and living conditions are determined by their faith - depending on whether you are Jewish or not - it is wrong. The monstrosity of theocracy is demonstrated more clearly every day by groups such as the Taliban and ISIS (Islamic State of Iraq and Syria).
4. Continued Israeli intransigence and expansion, building additional West Bank settlements.
5. During Israel’s war of independence (1947-49) several hundred thousand Palestinians were expelled or fled from what became the Jewish state.
6. Some public opinion is knee-jerk pro-Israel. Conservative American Judeo-Christians are often staunchly pro-Israel no matter what Israel’s transgressions are. And of course, there is some Jewish extremism, for example among some Orthodox Jews.
The case for Israel:
1. Israel happens to be technologically and militarily more advanced. Its Iron Dome intercepts many incoming missiles. Hamas may lack the capacity to cause a large-scale civilian bloodbath, but it certainly has the will do so, as it lobs rockets indiscriminately towards cities, schools, and hospitals.
As I said, the current escalation of violence was triggered by the murder of three Jewish kids. As President Obama said, no country can tolerate a rain of rockets descending on it day after day. Nor can any country accept dozens of tunnels underneath its borders enabling terrorists to enter and murder its population.
2 and 3. It can be argued that Israel is the most democratic and in some ways the most “civilized” country in the Middle East. Nevertheless, the Palestinians remain the victims of injustice and discrimination. This is Israel’s greatest transgression.
4. Israeli has returned some conquered territories ( for example Sinai) but it is holding on to parts of the West bank because the old borders are impossible to defend. The country would have an 8-mile wide “neck.”
5. When Israel declared its independence in 1947, it expelled many Palestinians, although many of them fled in anticipation of a victorious return, which never happened. Since then, the thousands of refugees have become millions. A “right of return” is an impossibility, as it would swamp Israel.
6. It is often impossible to distinguish anti-Israel public opinion from anti-Semitism. Many on the Left and millions of Europeans are downright anti-Semitic, which is an old European habit. In his recent Wall Street Journal article The Ugly Tide Washing Across Europe, Bernard-Henry Levy describes how in Frankfurt neo-Nazis joined hands with left-wing Islamists while chanting “Hamas, Hamas, Jews to the gas,” and how in some Amsterdam neighborhoods it is impossible to wear a yarmulke without being insulted or assaulted.
7. And one more thing: As the New York Times’ David Brooks (with whom I agree on this rare occasion) wrote on July 30: This conflict is becoming part of a wider struggle between competing Muslim countries and factions: Saudi Arabia, Iran, Egypt and the various Suni and Shiite factions each have their own vision for the future of the Middle East. This competition is a major factor in how each of them deals with Israel. The conflict is no longer one between Israel and a unified Muslim front.
Argument which can go either way:
To whom should the land belong? Who was there first? I wrote about this a few years ago. See my post on Israel and Palestine: Whose Turf is it?: Palestinians, who are Arabs, have lived in Palestine for many centuries. At the time of the foundation of Israel (1947-49), there were many more Palestinians than Jews in Israel. Jews have lived in Palestine since Moses, 5,000 years ago. Their numbers in that region have fluctuated. In biblical times there were several million Jews in Palestine. During the 1st century, Jews were the majority population in the region, about 2.5 million. During Ottoman rule, the Jewish population declined to almost nil - maybe 5,000. Jews were now a minority, Muslims a majority. By 1890, Jews were a growing minority of about 43,000. In 1914, just before World War I and the Balfour Declaration, Jews were a growing minority of about 100,000. By 1931, Jews had continued to grow as a minority, approaching 200,000. In 1947, just before Israeli Independence, Jews were a large minority of about 600,000. Much of the increase was due to the massive post-World War II immigration of Holocaust survivors.
Solution: This is a conflict between two competing nationalisms. One solution would be for Israel to become a non-Jewish state, as South Africa became a non-white ruled state. But this cannot happen. Jews won’t permit it. The only real solution, therefore, is the two-state solution. In order to achieve this, it is better that Israel negotiate with the West Bank-based Fatah faction and with the Palestinian Authority’s leader Mahmoud Abbas, rather than with the more extreme Gaza-based Hamas. Negotiations must include West Bank land swaps and the internalization of Jerusalem. One thing which is non-negotiable is Israel’s right to exist. leave comment here
© Tom Kando 2014
11 comments:
Tom- your first two premises are fundamentally false. (1. The “asymmetrical” number of deaths: Over 1600 Palestinians so far, of whom 75% are women, children and other innocent civilians. Over 60 Israelis, of whom 2 or 3 are civilians.
2. Israel practices Apartheid. Palestinians within Israel are second-class citizens, and many of those outside its borders have been living in subhuman conditions for over 60 years.)
The number of deaths on each side are not accurately counted at least for the Palestinians. No number comes out of Gaza that is not controlled by Hamas. The number of Civilian deaths in Gaza are a direct result of Hamas' efforts to put their weapons in civilian areas. Hamas is the aggressor here - the tunnels which were built because the Israelis allowed the importation of cement - were an aggressive act. They need to be eliminated.
The charge that Israel practices apartheid is absolute nonsense. Name any country in the middle east where a religious minority is allowed to vote, to have seats in parliament or even to practice their religion. Have you read about the treatment of the Christians in Nineva - a Christian community that is more than 2000 years old? The ISIS thugs came into the community and said get out, covert or we will kill you and then desecrated sacred places in the region.
As I think I said to you earlier, there is no equivalency in this fight. Hamas is the aggressor - the Israelis if anything have shown tremendous restraint. The arguments are the worst kind of sophistry.
Bravo l'artiste pour ce résumé d'une affaire sans happy end possible, sans K.O. de l'un des deux, et hélas nous connaissons le perdant. Ce ne sera pas l'abattoir comme en 36-45, les juifs feront beaucoup de "dégâts collatéraux" avant d'être poussés en Méditerranée. Hélas les pétro-milliardaires et fanatisés musulmans n'en ont rien à foutre.
Jonathan a de bonnes réponses à de bonnes questions. La négociation, des accords entre un tigre et un dauphin n'ont pas de sens. Alors ? une nouvelle solution finale en perspective ? sauf si deux nouveaux amis des US, l'EGYPTE et l'Iran décident de sauver le genre humain, seuls grands pays régionaux par leur culture millénaire à côté des royaumes sectaires bâtis par "nous" sur et dans du sable.....Rêver c'est bon!
Thanks for your comments, Jon and Fejto:
To Jon:
1) I myself mention ISIS in my piece, as an example of the monstrosity of theocracy.
2) Your intransigent reaction proves my point: an even-handed discussion of the problem is not possible. That’s why it’ll never be solved.
To Fejto:
1) Your comments are much more reasonable than Jonathan's (although I disagree with you about Jonathan. His questions are bad, not good).
For non-Francophone readers, here is what Fejto writes:
Kudos to the writer of this summary of an affair without possible happy end, without K.O. of one side by the other, and alas we know who will be the loser. It will not be the slaughterhouse as in 1936-45, the Jews will cause much collateral damage, before being shoved into the Mediterranean. Alas, the petro-billionaires and the Muslim fanatics couldn’t care less.
2) Jonathan has good answers to good questions. Negotiations between a tiger and a dolphin make no sense. So? A new final solution? Only if the US’ two new friends, Egypt and Iran, decide to save the human race, the only great regional countries with cultures that are thousands of years old, next to sectarian kingdoms built by “us” on and in the sand...dream on!
The whole idea of a country for the Jews is not based on religion, it is a humanitarian need for a homeland. Zionism is a good idea. It has been successful in every respect. If the Arabs had accepted any of the numerous offers for co-existence in the past, today's escalation would have been avoided.
What is unsolvable, is the need for Israel to have defensible borders. The answer might not be found in a two-state solution, but a one-state solution.
In this context, it is not Israel who is the tiger, but the Palestinians. Tigers like to feast on dolphins. Dolphins have no need for tough tiger meat.
"the Israel-Palestine problem will NEVER be solved." Maybe, you should have said "the Israel-Palestine problem will never be SOLVED."
We continually look for solutions, like "cease-fires" to impose on people in other states whose consciousness is not ultimately concerned about the whole.
This morning on the BBC, I heard again the idea of a "two-state SOLUTION." Actually, I think Israel would agree to this IF the Palestinians showed the capability of policing their society well enough to prevent people in its borders from launching missiles in at Israel. Thus, such solutions sound good in theory to people who live in countries that don't launch rockets at their neighbors.
Madeline, I am not sure that Israel wants a one-state solution, because if it remained a democracy and allowed Palestinians a vote, they would outnumber Israelis vote to take what Israel has for themselves, essential dissolving Israel from within. A one-state solution would need to be based on republican principles with checks and balances and very little direct voter input.
Gordon:
Israel IS already a binational state, whether the majority of Israeli's want it or not, and the growth of settlements are dictating history as we speak.
And you assume a Palestinian majority, like everyone else, which is, of course everyone's argument against a one state solution.
There are equitable ways of keeping Israel both democratic and Jewish, other than what you propose, even in a binational state. Where there is a will there is a way. But the will isn't there, on neither side.
Thank you for a making a non-trilling, non-labeling statement.
This is a dangerous and difficult situation. I find too much name-calling and shrillness.
You hhave provided a refreshing approach.
Good heated debate. Shows how vehement people’s emotions can get about this topic. Much (not all) of this has to do with identification. Many people (not all) identify with one side or the other.
My (random) input:
A Jewish state may not be a theocracy strictly speaking, but since its identity is based on ethnicity/culture/religion by definition (The “Jewish state”), it does possess an element of apartheid. This is unavoidable. But like Madeleine, I also support Zionism, because after millennia of worldwide diaspora and anti-Semitism culminating in the Holocaust, it was important to once and for all create a Jewish homeland. Sometimes I say (tongue in-cheek) that the Jewish state should have been created in some relatively empty place like Utah or Australia. This is obvious nonsense of course, since there were many compelling historical reasons for creating the Jewish homeland in Israel, but at least that would have avoided the Jewish-Muslim conflict...
An analogy comes to mind: How would one go about creating a homeland for gypsies - another perennially persecuted minority with a long history of diaspora, drifting from country to country for centuries?
Gordon basically repeats my point as to why a one-state solution would not work: Palestinians/ Muslims would simply swamp Jews.
Fejto’s Tiger-Dolphin metaphor is interesting.
My feelings are closest to Steve’s: In one word: ambivalence. I often say that there are NOT always two sides to every issue (Hitler, AIDS, rape, etc.) But on this one there ARE. That’s why negotiations are imperative.
To everyone: This discussion is typical of 'salon politics'. I am of course part of it, but it irritates me, nonetheless.
In my opinion, Israel will be the last man standing in a region that is so dysfunctional, that it will happen without the West's influence. It will happen without fanfare. And it will happen with the support of Egypt, Jordan, and Saudi Arabia.
The PLO is incapable of maintaining public order in the West Bank. Hamas is fouling its own backyard. Israel's Muslim neighbors are completely aware of this.
I do believe there will come a time when a one-state solution will be forced upon both Israelis and Palestinians as the only viable solution.
The trouble in other parts of the Middle East will welcome israel's IDF to maintain order.
Interesting:
Now we have Fejto's prediction that ultimately Israel will be shoved into the Mediterranean (not before causing a lot of "collateral damage") (does he mean maybe going nuclear?)
...and Madeleine predicting that Israel will be the last man standing...
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